On Wednesday, January 18th, 2017, the 1800B Introduction to Music Education class, which I am currently taking, was granted the opportunity of having guest speaker, Dr. Mark Hopkins, come in and talk to us about music education. It was very intriguing and interesting to hear his own perception of music education. He emphasized the importance of whether or not music is similar to literature and if it should be taught in the same style.
Dr. Hopkins’ approach to the idea that musical creativity should be taught from day one was rather surprising. I assumed that an individual with such extensive musical schooling would agree with the educational system. It was thought-provoking that, when asked to create an academic curriculum, he denied the opportunity. From my understanding, his unwillingness to do so was due to the fact that he believed that learning by ear before learning musical notation was more beneficial to a student. Furthermore, I believe that Dr. Hopkins brought up many points that solidified the unfortunate truth about music education.
From what I have read and heard, many teachers have the mentality that if they do not follow the curriculum, their professionalism will be at risk. In addition, it is clear that teachers who do not strictly follow a curriculum must work more in order to academically structure their class, with material such as, musical repertoire.
I was always taught music through notation. Dr. Hopkins addressed both the advantages and disadvantages of Music Method Books. Before hearing what he had to say, I felt as though there could only be advantages by learning from these books. To my surprise, I found that even many of the so called “advantages” were flawed. Advantages that were mentioned that I believe are not necessarily positive aspects of Method Books are that they unify band experience for everyone, that they acquire the same constructive steps for everyone, and that the book does not start with musical expression. However, this clearly doesn't consider the various learning styles that different individuals prefer. Therefore, educators should first experiment with varied learning styles and attempt to come up with an academic curriculum subjectively suited for their students. An interesting point brought up by Dr. Mark Hopkins about the curriculum drawing individuals into music making that they were unfamiliar with was something I believe many music students can relate to. For example, the music we were exposed to before our endeavours on music studies, may not have been the same as what we are learning now. In fact, they may be complete opposite ends of the spectrum. Personally, outside of academic music studies, I do not necessarily enjoy listening to classical music in my free time. Most times, I just listen to the top hit singles of the week. However, this is all music. The issue with having such a strict curriculum for such an abstract subject is that you are creating a barrier between music in the outside world and music that must be studied in a more academic environment. What individuals already know about music unfortunately does not relate to what is being taught. Frankly, what is taught may often be perceived as boring. Moreover, as Dr. Hopkins stated, solely sticking to a curriculum means that “someone else decides context for your class”. For someone who has not met a single one of your students to determine how they should be educated is quite absurd in my opinion.
I am grateful to have had the opportunity to be introduced to Dr. Mark Hopkins. One specific point that was brought up by him that stuck with me was his discussion on how to grade a student. He mentioned that there were three aspects of grading, which are: grading on process, people, and product. You cannot solely grade one without the other two. As an educator, you need to determine whether the student has improved, if this way of learning is working for them, and whether or not they achieved the end result that they hoped to achieve.
Guest Speaker: Lesley Dawe
On Monday, January 23, 2017, Lesley Dawe, author of “Fumbling Towards Vulnerability: Moving Out of the Familiar for Music Education’s Sake”, took time to connect with the 1800B Introduction to Music Education class through Skype. It was a wonderful, genuine experience. I use the word ‘genuine’ because during the Skype call, Lesley did not pretend to be someone she was not. Unlike what I have heard and read about teachers, constantly worrying about their professionalism being at risk, Lesley was straightforward about what music education meant to her.
It was refreshing to have the opportunity to hear what her perception was through discussion, as opposed to reading something she wrote. I enjoyed how she went on to further explain how she teaches in her classroom. Lesley mentioned that, although her days are unpredictable and at times can seem somewhat chaotic, she admires this because she gets to experience the joy of learning alongside her students. Finally, I appreciate her teaching style of incorporating music that her students listen to outside of the classroom with music they learn inside the classroom. I believe that this way, students are more engaged in the process of learning, and are able to enjoy music making.
I aspire to be an effective educator such as herself one day. Aside from her ability to create an immensely positive learning environment for her students, her perception on music education seems more abstract and creative. However, I appreciate that she does not disregard the curriculum completely. Being able to balance creativity while still following the academic curriculum is a difficult task, but in my opinion, students are grateful for educators who acquire this ability.
Guest Speaker: Randall Allsup
On Saturday, February 11, 2017, the 1800B Introduction to Music Education class was granted yet another wonderful opportunity to have a guest speaker come in and share their thoughts and knowledge with us. Having guest speaker, Randall Allsup, come in and set up various interactive workshops was an enlightening experience. Many of the workshops that we did as a class immensely pushed me out of my comfort zone. I am not familiar with improvisation, due to the fact that throughout my years of studying music, I was always taught “by the book”. Therefore, the improvisational workshops that Randall set up for the classroom was definitely not something I was initially a fan of. Nonetheless, the experience was not as terrifying as I thought it would be. At the beginning of the workshop, when Randall mentioned what kind of exercises we would be doing, I was dreading just the thought of it. However, through repetition of the exercises, I found myself becoming more and more comfortable with this type of learning environment.
I appreciated his outlook on education. He emphasized the importance of balance in a classroom. I feel as though many academic educators tend to gravitate towards one extreme or the other with their teaching methods; either believing that a learning environment should be completely curriculum based, or that it should be completely abstract with little to no rules and regulations. Randall stated that he believes that educators should always remember to balance the two; that a classroom needs to be a creative learning environment for everyone that does not neglect the academic process. Personally, I believe that this outlook on educating is best. From personal experience, I was rarely given the opportunity to express my musical creativity; there was constantly and right and a wrong way to do things. At the time, I did not see anything wrong with this. However, now I have come to realize that this learning style has placed a barrier on my musical creativity. I feel uncomfortable expressing myself musically because it is not something that I am used to. With that said, I am glad that my educators did not neglect the academic process. I feel as though, by following enforced academic criteria, I have obtained great musical knowledge that is beneficial to me.
The 1800B class was introduced to many interactive workshops where we were given creative freedom to create music using various instruments in just a couple of minutes; it was definitely an exercise that required less thinking and more doing. Although, some of us may have felt awkward or uncomfortable during the music making, when it came time to present our creations to the rest of the class, I can confidently say that the outcomes were beautiful. Being able to create music without many enforced limitations was a humbling experience. By the end of the workshop, I realized that music making is a joyful experience, and having the opportunity to share the beauty of your creations with others should not be overlooked.
Guest Speaker: Dr. Ruth Wright
On Monday March 6th, 2017, Dr. Ruth Wright came to the 1800B Introduction to Music Education class and expressed her views on musical education. Having the opportunity to listen to her personal outlooks on musical teaching was insightful and intriguing. She stated that the popularity of music courses amongst students is decreasing; that only “10-12% of kids take elective music.” Additionally, Dr. Ruth Wright mentioned that “students though of music as the least important school subject,” and many students felt as though the music they were learning in class was not “real music.” This attitude toward musical studies inspired Dr. Ruth Wright to develop teaching methods that would hopefully encourage students to see the musical potential in themselves.
Her outlook of musical education has more so to do with improvisation and creative expression. This means that as a teacher, it is important to think quick on your feet regarding your academic curriculum. Everyday, the teacher present in this type of classroom setting must musically engage students, make connections between school music and outside music, empower students, encourage independence, and personalize teaching methods to suit the needs of all students in the classroom. If a teacher acquired all of these defining factors in their teaching styles, students would hopefully develop an interest for music and feel more confident in their musical abilities. I find this teaching style extremely intellectual and well thought out. It breaks down the barrier of what being a musician means. As a society, there is a possibility that we created this barrier. I state this because, I feel as though music is becoming more of an exclusive area of expertise as opposed to inclusive. In my opinion, this is damaging to the musical world because it discourages individuals from believing that they possess musical potential.
Dr. Ruth Wright created an interactive activity for the classroom that dealt musical improvisation. The task was to get in groups and recreate a song, in about half an hour, using a variety of instruments. Dr. Ruth Wright created a learning environment where experimentation was encouraged. In all honesty, the thought of creating a musical performance in a limited amount of time seemed near impossible to me. However, being around students who are all engaged, actively participating, and putting in suggestions, without criticizing one another, made me more comfortable throughout the music making experience.
I feel as though having Dr. Ruth Wright come in was a wonderful experience because I was given the opportunity to step out of my comfort zone and explore myself musically. A question I would like to discuss with Dr. Ruth Wright would be regarding her insight on how she believes that musical passion comes to be amongst individuals. I would like to explore and hopefully acquire a greater understanding about this topic with educators like herself.
Guest Speaker: Kelly Bylica
On Wednesday, March 15, 2017, Kelly spoke to the 1800B Introduction to Music Education class as a guest speaker. It was a wonderful and interactive experience. Kelly talked about her past teaching experiences, and her journey as an educator. She mentioned the obstacles she faced during her years of teaching, as well as how she overcame them. My goal is to one day become a music educator myself which is why I found having Kelly come in, as a guest speaker, an amazing opportunity. She presented the class with an enjoyable and interactive experience. We were given children books based on pieces of music, and asked to make assumptions regarding what we think the song sounded like, solely through the images and text in the book.
During this experience, various ideas and assumptions were made regarding the correlation of books and songs. Through this task, the class learned that music has the ability to be transformed and perceived contrastingly by different individuals. Music is immensely abstract and encourages personal thoughts and interpretations. Kelly granted the class the opportunity to discuss why we believe that majority of students, more often than not, perceive music courses as unnecessary and uninteresting.
Many individuals feel discouraged in their music making abilities, and feel as though there is no correlation between school music and outside music. In my opinion, the barriers that academic music curriculums create discourage many individuals from pursuing music further in their lives, and may often even diminish their will to be associated with music in general. I feel as though the preconceived notion that some individuals obtain more talent in music than others, is quite absurd.
I believe that Kelly taught the class valuable lessons that we can apply to our own future teaching methods. I appreciated that she emphasized the importance of enforcing a connection between outside music and school music. I feel as though this is immensely important because it allows each student to develop a personal connection and understanding of what they are learning. Since music is all around us, uniting different musical aspects in the classroom may be a great way to ensure student participation and engagement.
Guest Speaker: Dr. Kevin Watson
On Monday, March 20th, 2017, Dr. Kevin Watson came to the 1800B Introduction to Music Education class as a guest speaker. He taught the class about improvisation and music making through aural transmission. We were given various improvisational tasks utilizing jazz techniques. As a class, we listened to several excerpts and reflected on what we heard, as well as the similarities and differences of each excerpt. Additionally, we were expected to play back a melody, instrumentally or vocally, that was played by Dr. Watson. Furthermore, every student was asked to individually improvise a continuation after hearing a couple measures of music that was played by Dr. Kevin Watson.
Dr. Watson emphasized the idea of playing music without notation. Personally, the tasks we were given were far out of my comfort zone. Jazz music and improvisation is not a strength of mine. I have spent many years of my life training though traditional and classical musical teaching methods that place immense importance on playing with notation. Truthfully, I felt as though this was not an enjoyable and interactive experience for me. Since I know that improvisation is a musical aspect that I struggle with, I do not like being pushed into participating in such exercises. I study classical music, and am currently in a program which embodies classical music, and I feel as though the theme of this class contradicted what I have been taught all of these years. Nevertheless, I have nothing against musical improvisation. I genuinely hope that one day I can step out of my comfort zone regarding music, and explore improvisation. However, being put on the spot seems unfair in my opinion, because many students have not had previous experience with such teaching methods. I believe that in order for a student to feel comfortable in an unfamiliar learning environment, the educator needs to understand that not all students share their personal outlook when it comes to learning. In all honesty, being asked to improvise on my own felt discouraging and uncomfortable.
With that being said, although I do not abide to Dr. Kevin Watson’s outlook of musical education, he is clearly an educated individual. It was a great opportunity to have him come in and discuss his personal views. The jazz and classical musical worlds differ a substantial amount, and I believe that I have these personal opinions due to the fact that I have been somewhat close minded to the various musical teachings and styles. Interviews
Interviewee: Goran Ristic
In my Introduction to Music Education class, I was given the task to interview an influential teacher in my life who has made an impact on me. I decided to interview my dad, Goran Ristic, because I feel as though the life lessons I have learned from him are immensely valuable.
In all honesty, I personally felt as though recording the interview was a little bit uncomfortable for both the interviewer and interviewee. In my opinion, knowing that you are being recorded, subconsciously puts pressure on an individual to put forth their best self, in order to not risk sounding ‘unprofessional’ in the recording. Furthermore, English is not the primary language spoken in my home, which made conversing in English for the interview feel somewhat unnatural. With that said, before the interview even started, I emphasized that neither of us should worry about what we say or how we say it. In my opinion, a “go-with-the-flow” mentality during an interview is the best way to ensure a genuine conversation between the interviewer and interviewee.
My dad constantly talks about his childhood, and hearing the same story over and over again can get quite boring. For example, my dad will always bring up a quote by Mark Twain stating “When I was a boy of fourteen, my father was so ignorant I could hardly stand to have the old man around. But when I got to be twenty-one, I was astonished at how much he had learned in seven years.” I would never give this quote much thought, but now that I’ve taken the time to reflect on it, it is an accurate representation of how I felt towards my dad growing up. In addition, after every story, I learn more and more about his childhood, as well as how it impacted his own parenting. During this interview, I was fortunate enough to learn even more about all of this. For example, my dad mentioned that his dad “didn't have enough time to spend with me…most of the time he was out of the home” (Goran Ristic, 2017). I was not aware of this, however, this statement opened my eyes and helped me reflect on my dad’s parenting. Goran Ristic truly does try his best to always spend as much time as possible with my brother and I. This is definitely an aspect of his parenting that I greatly appreciate but have unfortunately neglected for a number of years.
I briefly mentioned my personal thoughts on my dad’s parenting during the interview. Although it made me quite emotional, I felt as though it was something that needed to be said. He has done so much for me, and even though he already knows how much I appreciate him, I will never stop acknowledging all of his hard work. Towards the end of the interview, I did not worry about what I was going to say nor how I was going to say it; I just wanted to let my dad know that I value everything he has taught me and that I will most definitely apply what I have learned from him in my own parenting methods one day.
Interview (Goran Ristic) Transcript
Interviewer: Hi my name is Marija Ristic and I will be interviewing my dad Goran Ristic. Before we start the interview, I need to ask you a couple of questions, and the first one is, can I upload this recording to my website for my Intro to Music Ed class? It’s an assignment where we interview a teacher of some sort, it can be a teacher in school, a teacher in life, and I chose you regarding life. I was just wondering if i could take the recording and post it on my website so that others can listen to it and see what we talked about.
Interviewee: Yes, you may.
Interviewer: Okay, and I was also wondering, because I’m gonna do a write up about this interview, if i could use quotes from what you've said? Interviewee: By all means, you may.
Interviewer: And is it alright if I use your full name?
Interviewee: Yes.
Interviewer: Okay, perfect. To start the interview, my first question, if you are comfortable speaking about this, would you please tell me about your childhood? Interviewee: I was born in a poor family, my childhood was relatively tough, not as tough comparing to my dad’s childhood. He was born in a very poor family, in a village, most of the time he didn't have enough food to eat, not enough clothes to wear, really tough childhood. My childhood was relatively tough, but not as comfortable as childhoods that children have nowadays. I did not have multiple pairs of jeans for example, I couldn't go on vacations. I have not been on a vacation until age of 18. My dad was a good person, he made sure that he raised me properly, even though he didn't have enough time to spend with me because of his profession. he was a truck driver so most of the time he would be out of the home. He would be coming in the evening, extremely tired, watch a little bit of tv and go to bed. I cannot blame him for that. Basically I was raised on the asphalt. I spent my time outside with my friends, and not that I don't appreciate that, I had a really great childhood, so that shaped into the kind of person that I am, today. I had a really happy childhood, not enough of a lot of things that i wanted, but a very good quality childhood, I would say. In terms of the later part of my childhood, when I became a student, I lost my mom and I took that really hard. You, Marija, can really relate to that because of the fact that you lost your mom as well. I had to cope with that. My dad helped a lot because he filled in my mom’s role as well. He was a mom and a dad to me, he was working really hard and always making sure that I had money, even when he did not have enough for himself. It was a very hard time, because it was hyperinflation in my country, but he was great during that time. I always had more than enough during my studies after I lost my mom. I really appreciate everything he’s done for me during that time.
Interviewer: Would you say, in terms of your parenting, is their anything that you do differently? Comparing you and your father, how you raise your children.
Interviewee: My dad, like I said, did not have enough time to spend with me. Again, I cannot blame him for that because of his type of job. Maybe to some extent, it was due to his personality as well. He's a nice person, but he is not the type that would spend a lot of time with kids for sure, but I'm on the opposite side. I do like to spend a lot of time with kids. I made sure, that while my daughter and son were kids, to spend a lot of time with them. I was working a lot with them, I was engaged in their sports activities, arts activities, school homework. I wanted to help them out with every possible thing that I could. I always made sure to spend every single moment, that I could spare, to spend with them, aside from my job and my other responsibilities. I think that, I made sure that I do things differently from my dad because that was the one thing that I missed during my childhood; spending more time with my dad. Which is why I made sure that I spent a lot of time with you, Marija, and your brother.
Interviewer: Where did you develop the mindset that spending time with your children is essential? If that is, like you said, not what you got as a child.
Interviewee: As I mentioned, I did not get to spend much time with my father, and this was one of the things that I really missed when I was a kid. I made sure that the way I raised my kids, that they are not longing for the same thing, that they have enough quality time with their dad, that they get to spend time with their dad. Also, when I was a kid, I was observing other families, and especially my relatives, and observing different styles of parenting so I took lessons from all of those families. I basically applied all of those things that I mentioned in my parenting style.
Interviewer: That’s nice. Another question, what do you think you do similar to your dad? In terms of parenting methods. What did you take from him that’s positive?
Interviewee: Many positive things. My dad taught me to be a hard working person, to be honest, own the task, responsible, accountable, and be nice with people. The way I was raising my kids, I tried to pass on those same traits, to teach them the same values, and I’m pretty sure that I succeeded in that, so that they are the same kind of people that I wanted to develop.
Interviewer: That’s nice. This is going to be my final question. As your daughter, what advice would you give me when it comes time to hopefully raise my own children one day, and what I can take from it?
Interviewee: I would say, you will have your own way. We all have our unique ways of parenting, no one can teach that kind of thing, you just go with the flow. You will basically relate to these stories and to the kind of parenting style my dad had, and the parenting style that I have, that you experienced, and that you will take the best of things from what my dad did, and from what I did. You will also look to other families, and you should take the best things from other families, and it will be kind of a mixture of all these good things which you will apply to your parenting style. Some of the things will also come as you mature, as you become a parent. Once you have kids, things will come to you and you will understand many things that you cannot see right now.
Interviewer: I’m done with my questions, but before I finish this interview, I would just like to tell you something. As my dad, I was thinking about what kind of questions to ask, and how this interview was going to go, but I also thought of what you taught me growing up and what I've got from it. Of course, I’m going to tear up right now, but I've written down a bunch and I feel like a lot do really apply to you. This might be typical, in the eyes of others, but you've taught me how to become a fighter, and how to not give up, and just not to judge. I really appreciate everything that you’ve done for me, and I don’t know if it’s ever since mom passed away, but I really see how difficult how parenting can be and how parents do so much for their children. I feel like a lot of us, not really take that for granted, but don't notice it. I feel as though the event with mom passing kind of opened my eyes as to everything you have taught me, and her as well of course. That’s just a side note for you as to why I wanted to interview you. Academic educators have had an impact on me, but I feel like the life lessons that I was taught from you, I can’t really get from anyone else. It’s something that I will, with my own children, hopefully one day, apply and basically do the same things. I feel like I will surely find other methods, but I really appreciate everything that you’ve done for me and everything that you've taught me. That’s just a little side note.
Interviewee: That’s wonderful. You didn't just make my day, you just made my life.
Interviewer: That’s all for the interview, I’m just going to ask you again, briefly. Is it okay if I post this whole recording on my website?
Interviewee: Of course it is.
Interviewer: Okay, and that’s all for my interview. Thank you so much for letting me interview you and that’s it. Okay, bye now! Interviewee: Bye now!
Student Interview Reflection With Brian Marshall (Faculty of Music) & Nico Waltenbury (Faculty of Social Science)
Well there you have it. Two very different musical perspectives from two students studying Western University. I interviewed a student studying at the faculty of music and a student studying at the faculty of social science. Both interviewees got the opportunity to freely express their personal outlooks on music. Of course I did not have any set expectations regarding what the interviewees were going to say. However, I assumed that the student studying music would have talked about a heartfelt story, such as, that they fell in love with their instrument the moment they started studying it. Additionally, I assumed that the student not studying music would not have been so involved in the musical world. Clearly, both of my assumptions were wrong. I am in no way negatively affected by the results. In fact, I am pleasantly surprised. Having initial assumptions going into the interview and realizing that this way not the case for my interviewees, was an eye opening experience.
The student currently enrolled in the faculty of music at Western University, Brian Marshall, brought up several events that led him to his current educational path. He mentioned that neither of his parents played an instrument, but both greatly enjoyed music, and that they started him up, musically, when he was young. At the beginning of our interview together, he mentioned that he had a strong drive and passion to pursue music ever since he was a kid. This brought me to wonder… For Brian, what was the root cause of his drive and passion? He further went on and explained how elementary school was a prominent factor in his musical decisions. During the interview, Brian talked about how the competitive atmosphere of his music classes impacted his musical journey. He stated, and I quote, “me beating everyone else created a drive for music.” I found this quite interesting because, personally, I do not take delight in competitions of any sort. Although, I do always need to remind myself that everyone is different. Brian further went on to explain that the competitive mindset during elementary school music classes led to him discovering that music was a subject that he was good at, which led him to the realization that he enjoys music. Lastly, he voiced the great impact that music has on his everyday life and that he listens to music, to quote, “every second of the day”. As well, to quote Brian Marshall, “leaving music would be like leaving a part of my life.” It is wonderful to hear that this student is studying what he truly enjoys.
The second interview was with a student currently enrolled in the faculty of social science at Western University, Nico Waltenbury. Although music did not become his area of study, he definitely voiced his personal opinions about how music is present in his life. Nico stated that the reason he did not pursue music was due to the fact that, he found himself enjoying more of the STEM courses during his schooling as opposed to the music courses. STEM is an acronym for the fields of science, technology, engineering and math. In his opinion, he did not feel as though music was a subject that he excelled in, in terms of skill and passion. Furthermore, Nico mentioned that he enjoyed his musical experiences during his earlier stages of education, but that he did not have, and I quote, “the opportunity to pursue music further” in his childhood. Nonetheless, when asked how he interacts, Nico Waltenbury stated, and I quote, that “music is all around us… everyone interacts to it, just to different degrees.” He emphasized that he does enjoy music and musical theatre, and is immersed in the musical lifestyle, just in a different way.
To conclude, it was genuinely a gift to have been able to interview two very different individuals regarding the same area of study and be able to reflect on their responses. As Nico said, “music is all around us,” and it impresses me how everyone can interact with music so differently, yet nevertheless, have such distinct thoughts and feelings towards it.